I'm Sitting Down

Y'know what THE byler song is for me?

It is absolutely 'Turning Out' by AJR. It's just so perfect for everything for them I'm telling you it's so them !!!!

I beg you all to listen to it because it is veryveryvery Mike Wheeler coded

Mentally I'm still here

WHO IS IT 😭

please duffers just release the trailer there can't be more to hide

Oh god how come those twitter pages haven't been terminated yet lmao

The Strange Postponement of Mike and Will's relationship

If Mike and Will had remained as close as they were in Season 2 in the subsequent seasons, the "are they gay?" rumors absolutely would have spread among the General Audience, as they entered their official teen/dating/sexual awakening years.

There have been peculiar writing choices that seem to have no other explanation but to postpone romantic rumors about these two.

The show does it's damnedest to keep these best-friends-since-kindergarten apart once they enter puberty. The only interaction that possibly hints at romance in Season 3 is their virtual double date with Lumax where Mike is concerned for Will's well-being one time. This was necessary to reestablish their "good friendness" at the start of the season to set-up their breakup during the Rain Fight.

Then, of course, the Rain Fight happens. Mike says "It's not my fault you don't like girls." They effectively "break up."

But then there is the strange, interesting choice that there is no resolution ever about the Rain Fight. The apology for ignoring Will's D&D game comes from Lucas instead of Mike:

Will had his blow-up with MIKE, not Lucas! And we know that Mike absolutely was DRIVEN to apologize to Will, but we don't see it. Maybe he actually did, but it was offscreen. But why not have it ON screen? Why not clear the air on whether Mike thought Will was gay and was being homophobic to Will? Why not clarify THEN that Mike is a straight ally who supports his gay best friend, setting things up for Will to have a coming-out arc where he finds a love interest who is not Mike?

Instead, the writers made sure they had NO conversations for nearly all the rest of the season. They made sure Mike was focused on trying to repair things with El and blurting out "I love her." These two things together kept the Gay Rumors(TM) in check.

Season 4 then dramatizes how they'd GROWN APART -- specifically, how they don't seem to have stayed in contact and Mike seems to ignore Will.

What a strange thing for the writers to do! Mike and Will had been on good terms. That's because it was the start-of-season set-up for an ARC where they become close again.

Alright, so they soon repair things. But for what?

The Will Counseling Hour:

They literally have no conversations with each other where Will isn't comforting Mike and/or talking about El. To the extent that the GA was annoyed that Mike was "useless" and the California plotline was a "waste of time."

(Either the Duffers were bad writers or had a reason to spend so much time on the California plot. Hmm...)

The show was putting Byler in a holding pattern. The show established that Mike and Will were friends again, but with a "beard" on Mike: his relationship with El. Will's attempt to talk about anything ELSE -- like playing Nintendo and D&D -- was ignored as Mike worried about El.

The Will Counseling Hour ends only with their very LAST conversation of season 4, when Will shares that he can still feel Vecna. Mike becomes the Counselor: he resolves that they will beat Vecna. The bringing of these two together, along with signs that Mike and El are drifting apart, lay the trajectory for Season 5.

Season 5 will be the first season with Unfiltered Byler(TM) since Season 2.

EVERYTHING that kept the GA from thinking about the possibility of Byler, (1) how young they were in Season 2, (2) their being kept artificially apart and (3) Mike's focus on his relationship with El, will have fallen away.

For the first time since Season 2, the A Plot and Mike and Will being close ("a team") will mesh.

Meanwhile, we'll get Season 2 Mike because Will will also be the center of the story and IN DANGER. It's impossible to imagine Mike being his aloof start-of-Season-4 self. Add to all this Season 4 hormones: we're likely to see the heart-eyes romantic, Will-Voice-speaking boy in love we Bylers see in the 2nd half of Season 4.

And there's the Painting Lie, which the Duffers have told Finn Wolfhard will "pay off in the end." Mike WILL KNOW Will loves him, and loved him so much as to sacrifice himself for him.

Even if one doesn't accept Byler, one can't deny that there has to be a DIRECT RECKONING over whether Mike returns Will's feelings.

The entire structure of how the show has presented their relationship is building up toward this. The Strange Postponement of Byler had a purpose.

-teambyler

EDIT: You might enjoy my s5 speculations in "How the Duffers likely will make the general audience AWARE of Byler and CHEER for Byler" =D

Since I’ve seen a lot of people saying that Noah Schnapp shipping Byler or saying things like “some of Mike and Will scenes can be interpreted as romantic” (paraphrasing) could turn into queerbait if the ship doesn’t come to fruition, I feel like y’all need to be grounded.

Noah is an actor, not a writer. He is a gay human being and viewer of the show. He is allowed to ship the characters the same way the audience does even if he didn’t know the ending —the way he didn’t when he stated he shipped Mike and Will in S4.

His comments such as “scenes can be interpreted as romantic” are him interpreting the show the way a viewer that enjoys the ship does —he is not god.

And if the ship does not come to fruition the way you’re hoping it does, it was not queerbait on his behalf. He is just enjoying the joy you get from his character’s queerness. And it is definitely not “the worst thing he’s ever done.” He has already done much worse with his responsibility as a young adult in the public eye 🤨🤨🤨

I respect the hell out of this

alright. i'm taking it upon myself to put something to rest.

there is a new mlvn argument on the market, and i have to say, it is the absolute most BACKWARDS, IDIOTIC, WILFULLY IGNORANT take i have ever seen from them. and it is so easily disprovable that i need to make a post about it and put it in the ground early on.

if you've been around since s4 vol1 era, then you've seen the evolution of their arguments surrounding the monologue. first it was "mlvn was love at first sight, because mike said so". they were all posting the clip from s1 ep 1 of mike finding el in the woods, clips from all throughout s1, and saying "this mike was in love with el!!" because mike said so. in the monologue. when bylers pointed out that this claim from mike directly contrasts his behavior in s1, we were called delusional and told we were just coping. i was even told by someone on reddit that mike wasn't acting like he loved her because he was afraid of being made fun of by dustin and lucas, which deserves it's own separate post, but anyways...

after what finn said at the paris con, aka this:

bylers obviously took this as a win, because it very obviously completely dismisses the idea that mike was being truthful in the monologue. because of this, mlvn's argument has shifted. now, they are claiming that what mike said in the monologue, "I knew right then and there in that moment that I loved you." was not a lie, but HYPERBOLE.

here's just a few examples of this.

holy fuck. where do i even start with this...

i guess let me start by saying that i am an english major. i am a creative writing student. english language arts has always been my forte. it's been my best subject my entire life. i was the kid people went to for help in ELA (english language arts). i was the one tutoring my friends. i was the one explaining things to them. in college my friends would line up to get my help with their english work. i edited and revised their essays. i spent close to 10 hours a week in english classes discussing literary devices and analyzing different stories, which i excelled at.

i am not trying to 'flex', i am simply providing context as to why i believe my opinion on this is worth something. mlvns try to say being a writing/film student means nothing in this argument, but it really really fucking does. i, and countless others in the byler fandom, are LITERALLY more educated in this sort of thing than those who did not spend thousands of dollars to study it. sure we may not be renowned writers with masters degrees, but who do you think we learned from?? our professors, who ARE renowned writers with masters degrees. its no different than trusting the opinion of a biology major when talking about biology. of course ELA is more subjective and free, but when you actually study it you find that its more concrete than you'd think. there are definitions, there are guidelines, there are rights and wrongs. of course you do not have to obey those rules, but in the world of publishing and analysis there are things that make sense, and things that don't make sense.

for example. you can totally write a story where a character says "i knew right then and there in that moment that i loved you" and add whatever explanation or nuance that you want. you can write that with the intention of the character being truthful, but maybe exaggerating a bit. whatever you please. you have the creative freedom to do that whether it makes sense or not.

what you cannot do is claim that that phrase is a hyperbole in that context, or any context, because that is OBJECTIVELY wrong. that is incorrect and inarguable. there are phrases that could potentially be debated between those educated in ELA on whether or not it could be considered a hyperbole, but that would requite the phrase to have ambiguous wording. the phrase in question does not check those boxes. it is not ambiguous in any way shape or form. it's not hyperbole. it's not even hyperbolic in any way.

here's a link to an article with 50 different examples of hyperboles. i promise you that our quote in question will not be there, and that nothing on that list will be remotely similar to it.

"I knew right then and there in that moment that I loved you."

i mean you are genuinely a fucking doofus if you're genuinely trying to claim this is a hyperbole. i need you to be so fucking for real. mike is referring back to a specific moment, remember? maybe you don't because i know y'all don't even watch the show, so let me refresh your memory:

"But the truth is, El...I don't know how to live without you. I feel like my life started that day we found you in the woods. You were wearing that yellow Benny's Burgers shirt, and it was so big it almost swallowed you whole. I knew right then and there in that moment that i loved you. And I have loved you every day since."

el even has a flashback to that exact moment in the scene right after he says it, and right before he says "I knew right then and there etc..."

he literally starts it off with "The truth is"

not meant to be taken literally.

would it make sense to say "The truth is, I'm so tired I could sleep for a century." or "The truth is, I'm so hungry I could eat a horse." or "The truth is, I'm dying of laughter."

NO! IT WOULDNT!

mike's monologue was written/approved by the duffers. the same duffers who graduated from a very prestigious film school and created the biggest tv show in the world. they know what a fucking hyperbole is and that you don't preface one with "the truth is". it is genuinely ridiculous to suggest that they let that stay in a scene where a character is supposed to be finally revealing the truth to both another character and the audience.

let's circle back to those screenshots of dumbass mlvns cosplaying as ELA students

"i fell in love with you instantly" vs "i fell in love with you mere days after we met . ur arguing semantics when the point is that they fell for each other really fast"

please tell me, in WHAT fucking world does someone say "I knew right then and there [in the first moment I saw you] that I loved you" when trying to explain that they really fell in love a few days later. and in WHAT UNIVERSE would a WRITER choose to have their character, who is supposed to finally be telling the unfiltered truth, say that. the answer is, there isn't one. that is so fucking backwards and idiotic that i can't believe i'm even having to explain why. the monologue is fabricated. it was written and approved by professional writers and directors. if mike fell in love with el at some later point in s1, or realized it at some later point in s1, then he could've just fucking said that. he could've just told her the moment he fell for her or the moment he realized. they didn't have to make it all twisted and confusing for no reason. he has absolutely no reason to lie or exaggerate (if he is straight and in love with her).

DING A LING A LING A LING!!!!! THATS A BELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"this feels like taking mikes words too literally"

oh, my apologies for taking his words literally during a fucking CONFESSION OF LOVE that he gave her while she was DYING. sorry for taking a line prefaced by "The truth is" literally. you are totally right and i will never do that again!

"when looking back on it it probably does feel like he loved her from the start"

cute sentiment, but that's literally NOT WHAT HE SAID. for the millionth time (see how i just used a hyperbole in a place where it makes sense? where i didn't preface it by saying it was the unfiltered truth?) he said "I knew right then and there in that moment that I loved you." he is saying he saw el in the woods in the rain in her yellow benny's burgers shirt, and KNEW he loved her. he realized it in that moment. that is what he wants el to believe. he is using specific language to pin point the moment he realized it on that moment. like im so serious when i say that if you try to say anything else you genuinely have worms for brains.

any way you logically look at this, it is crushing for mlvn. even if it was a hyperbole, which it is NOT, why the hell would the writers have him exaggerate his feelings to cater to her when it would be much more meaningful for his ACTUAL feelings to save her life?? why would mike feel like he needed to exaggerate?? and i'm sorry, i dont buy the heat of the moment bs. mike has nearly lost el multiple times because he kept lying to her. they had a bad fight days earlier because mike wouldn't tell her the truth. so he finally gets another chance to tell her the truth, and he EXAGGERATES?? HE TELLS A WHITE LIE??? that would also be crushing for mlvn. but none of that matters, because it's not a hyperbole, it's a lie. a flat out lie.

let be me clear, that does not make mike a bad person. in fact, it actually makes him an incredible, caring, selfless person. (remember the synopsis for s4 ep9? "With selfless hearts and a clash of metal, heroes fight from every corner of the battle field to save Hawkins ---and the world itself.") he lied because he knows he doesn't love el the way she wants and he feels like his actual love for her (which is platonic) would not be enough to save her. he devalues his own feelings because they are not what el wants. this is why he nodded after will said "It's scary to open up like that, to say how you really feel. Especially to people you care about the most. Because...what if they don't like the truth?" he feels like he owes el the love she wants, and he is willing to lie to her if it means saving her life. because he truly does love her and care about her, so much that he will do whatever it takes to not lose her.

and i know a lot of mlvn's devalue literary/media analysis and english/creative writing, and our opinions in general, so in case all that wasn't enough, i also asked mlvn's old friend about this. their friend being AI.

mlvns, everything with a lick of sense, including artificial intelligence, is proving you wrong. you are incorrect. what finn said at the paris con put the nail in your ships coffin and you know it. so please stop embarrassing yourselves on the internet and making dumbass claims like this when you know nothing about the subject. you look stupid.

this rant isnt just coming from a place of byler truther anger, it's english major anger. LEAVE MY SUBJECT ALONE. PLEASE.

The edginggate is real

even though mike was scared, he walked up to will on the swings and asked him if he wanted to be his friend. and will said yes. that's the best thing mike's ever done and he did it scared. and with will.

something something mike may be scared but if he has will then things will be okay something something that's how he'll accept himself something something byler endgame

soft byler moments part 4 !! this time it's a modern au + i tried 2 format it like theyre snapchat stories in a groupchat but i've never actually been in a sc groupchat so i had 2 guess lol

also im So sorry for how long this took 2 get done, i literally started this august 13th. the tracked time is over 32hrs. ive semi-lost my mind bcuz of this.

reblogs >> likes

u know the gist , close-ups w clean versions and backstories/thoughts behind them under the cut >

little preface:

- these will probably be very short so im gonna do two at once

- theyre aged up a lil (15/16) and its set in 2022

- the groupchat is called 'byler hate club <3' and i think that the two of them get added periodically and either get kicked or leave themselves

- their snap names are 'dustin B)' , 'lucas' , 'madmax' , and 'el🌸' (and mike and will's would probably also just b their names like lucas?) but if u wanna go a little further, i think their users would b things like ‘dustinanddragons’ or ‘dungeonsanddustin’, ‘bboylucas’ or smth, either just ‘madmax’ or ‘sk8rgirl’, el’s would probably just b her name like ‘elhop’ or ‘janehop’, and of course mike’s and will’s would be ‘paladinmike’ and ‘willthewise’ bcuz duh.

- they have a seperate groupchat called ‘the party’ that does have all of them , this ones just 4 shits and giggles

- i made mikes hair curlier bcuz i wanted 2 and its 2 late 2 stop me so

- if u see anything that looks wrong or weird just ignore it i cannot b bothered 2 work on this anymore lmao

all refs i used can be found here (as well as spoilers for future stuff :O)

these two are a prime example of them just being in their own little bubble and completely forgetting that other people are even around. i wanted to give mike a more .. alternative? style. something similar to mine, and i usually dress in all black with bits of red, so for mike i did mostly black with bits of blue :) (also peep the pins on his backpack and the patches on the shirt and whatnot). once again i have will wearing different colour nail polish in all of them, but mikes is still only black . (first ones set in the wheeler basement , second one in the school)

this first one is kind of unintentionally sad? i didn’t realize how upset he seemed until after i finished it. actually these two could work as the second one being the day after the first. oH also in the first one i gave mike a belt that i actually own and its literally so cool its my favourite belt ever. (first one set on the hill where cerebro would b if this was still set in the 80s , second one in mikes room)

fun fact one of the reasons this took so fucking long is bcuz i was procrastinating doing the backgrounds for these two and the next one. u can probably guess why. anyways i really like how these turned out, they might be my favourite tbh. i dont really know what 2 say abt these .. i think they r pretty self explanatory. OH ACTUALLY i gave mike a black iphone w a clear case that has blue stars on it (which u can see in the second and seventh one) and will a white iphone with a .. idk what u call that pattern but its the phone in the first one. (first one is max, el + will waiting in mike’s front yard 4 him 2 get home from.. somewhere? maybe a weekend trip 2 visit relatives w his family or smth. second one is dustin, lucas, will + mike impulse-baking cookies at some ungodly hour at night during a party sleepover at mikes)

i really hate how mikes hair turned out in the first one but i spent so long on it and redid it So many times that i simply cannot b bothered 2 try and do it again. also pls notice how both of them r wearing ponytail holders in all of these (except this last one i lowkey forgot but we can pretend they r just on the other arms) tbh i dont really know if i think mike would listen 2 the nbhd or not but its what was on the shirt in the ref and i didn’t want 2 have it just b a plain black shirt so i kept it. (first one is a hangout session w the party.. i dont really have a specific idea as 2 where, so that can b up to u. second one is .. honestly im not entirely sure i just thought the ref was cute so i used it lol)

once again sorry about this taking a literal month, but my life kinda got a little fucking crazy in august so i didn’t have much time or energy to work on this. i have no idea as 2 when the next one of these will b coming, but i have a few ideas for it already. i think thats all? ill probably have some more byler art coming soon thats not gonna be like this, but no promises lol

the effect heteronormativity has on how watchers view byler keeps me up at night so i wrote out their story but took out names & instead used “boy” and “girl” 

read this and tell me it’s not romantic:

boy asks girl to be friends on the first day of kindergarten.

boy has girls artwork all over his walls. boy has a binder full of girls drawings.

girl goes missing in 7th grade and boy does everything in his power to find her.

when girl is found and is recovering in the hospital boy is the only one not sleeping while waiting for her to wake up and when she does wake up he runs to her room and lays his head on her chest.

a year later when girl is struggling with ptsd, boy is always there for her. when she leaves school early to go to the doctor, he stares longingly and sadly at her empty desk. he notices when she’s quiet, even though she’s always quiet. when she has a flashback on halloween he puts an arm around her and takes her back to his house safely and talks about what she’s going through. when she’s going through something extremely scary he sleeps on her floor so she won’t have to be alone. when she goes back to the hospital, boy sleeps in a chair next to her bed. when girl is possessed and loses her memory, she only remembers her mom and boy. later on, boy starts crying and says asking her to be his friend on the first day of kindergarten is the best thing he’s ever done.

when boy gets a girlfriend, girl and boy start having problems for the first time in their relationship. after 6 months, boy and girl get in a fight over boy ruining their friend group by spending all of his time with his girlfriend, and girl leaves his house. boy bikes across town in the rain to her house and bangs on her door screaming apologies and begging her to come out so they can talk.

when girl is packing to move away, she assures boy she won’t move on from him and their friend group and he reacts like this:

then boy’s girlfriend, who is moving away with girl’s family too, says she loves him and kisses him and he reacts like this:

when boy is leaving girls house after she’s gone, he looks back at her house sadly and bikes away. he goes home to his mom and this happens:

6 months later when boy goes to visit his girlfriend and girl across the country, boy is awkward to girl and won’t hug her, even though it had never been weird for them to hug before. he just pats her on the shoulder.

boy, girl, and boy’s girlfriend go to a roller rink where girl feels ignored and like a third wheel. boy’s girlfriend gets publicly bullied and runs away. while boy and girl are looking for her boy gets angry at girl for moping, not talking, and rolling her eyes because she “sabotaged the whole day”, even though it seemed like he was ignoring her.

their argument goes like this:

girl: well what about us?

boy: *stops walking and turns around* what?

girl: you’re mad that i didn’t talk to you? you’ve made it clear you’re not interested in anything i have to say

boy: that’s just not true.

girl: you called maybe a couple of times, it’s been a year. meanwhile [girlfriend] has a book of letters from you.

boy: that’s because she’s my girlfriend!

girl: and us?

boy: we’re friends! we’re. friends.

girl: well we used to be best friends!

boy: …well maybe you should’ve reached out more, i don’t know, but why is this on me? why am i the bad guy?

later on, boy comes in girls room and thanks her for knocking some sense into him because he was being a total self pitying idiot. when he starts to talk about the last few days, girl says she deserved it and boy assures her she didn’t deserve anything he did to her. boy says their friends back home are great, but it’s not the same without girl. and maybe he was worrying too much about his girlfriend and lost girl. boy says he wants them to go back to being best friends.

also during this trip, boy’s girlfriend gets upset with him because he’s never said “i love you” to her. he signed all of his letters with “from, boy”, and he still doesn’t say it even when she’s crying and practically begging him to.

boy talks to girl about how he’s afraid his girlfriend doesn’t need him anymore and feels inferior to her.

girl gives boy a painting she made for him and confesses her love for him, but uses his girlfriends name to cover it up, so boy thinks this is actually his girlfriend’s feelings. she says she’s afraid of losing him and will always need him, and that he is the heart of their group and everything would fall apart without him.

after this, boy is able to say “i love you” to his girlfriend, but they are distant after it and his girlfriend doesn’t talk to him much.